Type 23 Duke Class

Post here about equipment carried on ships
User avatar
Little h
Posts: 1727
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 6:53 pm

Re: RN Frigates: Type 23 Duke Class

Unread post by Little h »

A bit dated now (2013), but the info might help those who would like ready reference to the ships in the class that are Towed Array equipped.

Final UK Navy Type 23 Frigate Outfitted with Thales Sonar 2087

Following an extensive refit, HMS Portland has become the final Royal Navy Type 23 frigate to be fitted with Thales UK’s Sonar 2087, a towed array sonar system that enables warships to hunt submarines at considerable distances and locate them beyond the range from which they can launch an attack. Portland has now returned to service, with a re-dedication ceremony on 21st March.

The 12-month multi-million pound refit in Rosyth Royal Dockyard of Portland’s sensors, weapons and systems completes a successful joint programme between industry and the UK’s Ministry of Defence (MOD) to ensure the upgraded ships are now the most advanced of their kind in service.

The Royal Navy has described how the combination of a Type 23 frigate fitted with Thales’s Sonar 2087 and a Merlin helicopter equipped with the Thales FLASH dipping sonar makes the class the “most potent anti-submarine warfare platform of any navy at sea today”.

Eight of the Royal Navy’s fleet of Type 23 frigates have now been upgraded for use as submarine hunters. The other seven upgraded ships are Westminster, Northumberland, Richmond, Somerset, Sutherland, Kent and St Albans.

Sonar 2087 is a low-frequency sonar with both active and passive sonar arrays. The system is manufactured at Thales sites in the UK (Cheadle Heath in Manchester and Templecombe in Somerset) and France (Brest).

Source; navaltoday.com April 12, 2013

Again, for ease of reference; the Type 2087 towed array sonar system is/was fitted to the following 8 x Type 23 Duke Class Frigates:-

HMS Kent (F78)
HMS Westminster (F237)
HMS Northumberland (F238) **
HMS Richmond (F239)
HMS Somerset (F82)
HMS Sutherland (F81)
HMS Portland (F79)
HMS St Albans (F83)


5 Nov 2018 NavyLookout on Twitter - Save the Royal Navy.org
** HMS Northumberland deploys her Type 2087 Towed Array Sonar during exercise #TridentJuncture Yellow body is the Low Frequency Active Sonar (LFAS) transducer
, DrPyMTvX4AA2hlf StRN twitter HMS Nort Type 2087 Yellow body Low Freq Active Sonar (LFAS) transducer.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Little h
User avatar
ivorthediver
Posts: 3659
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:42 pm
Location: Cambridge Shore Battery

Re: RN Frigates: Type 23 Duke Class

Unread post by ivorthediver »

Little h wrote: Sat Nov 10, 2018 2:17 am A bit dated now (2013), but the info might help those who would like ready reference to the ships in the class that are Towed Array equipped.

Final UK Navy Type 23 Frigate Outfitted with Thales Sonar 2087

Following an extensive refit, HMS Portland has become the final Royal Navy Type 23 frigate to be fitted with Thales UK’s Sonar 2087, a towed array sonar system that enables warships to hunt submarines at considerable distances and locate them beyond the range from which they can launch an attack. Portland has now returned to service, with a re-dedication ceremony on 21st March.

The 12-month multi-million pound refit in Rosyth Royal Dockyard of Portland’s sensors, weapons and systems completes a successful joint programme between industry and the UK’s Ministry of Defence (MOD) to ensure the upgraded ships are now the most advanced of their kind in service.

The Royal Navy has described how the combination of a Type 23 frigate fitted with Thales’s Sonar 2087 and a Merlin helicopter equipped with the Thales FLASH dipping sonar makes the class the “most potent anti-submarine warfare platform of any navy at sea today”.

Eight of the Royal Navy’s fleet of Type 23 frigates have now been upgraded for use as submarine hunters. The other seven upgraded ships are Westminster, Northumberland, Richmond, Somerset, Sutherland, Kent and St Albans.

Sonar 2087 is a low-frequency sonar with both active and passive sonar arrays. The system is manufactured at Thales sites in the UK (Cheadle Heath in Manchester and Templecombe in Somerset) and France (Brest).

Source; navaltoday.com April 12, 2013

Again, for ease of reference; the Type 2087 towed array sonar system is/was fitted to the following 8 x Type 23 Duke Class Frigates:-

HMS Kent (F78)
HMS Westminster (F237)
HMS Northumberland (F238) **
HMS Richmond (F239)
HMS Somerset (F82)
HMS Sutherland (F81)
HMS Portland (F79)
HMS St Albans (F83)


5 Nov 2018 NavyLookout on Twitter - Save the Royal Navy.org
** HMS Northumberland deploys her Type 2087 Towed Array Sonar during exercise #TridentJuncture Yellow body is the Low Frequency Active Sonar (LFAS) transducer

, DrPyMTvX4AA2hlf StRN twitter HMS Nort Type 2087 Yellow body Low Freq Active Sonar (LFAS) transducer.jpg
Excellent post Harry and many thanks for the educational information .

Please don't take offence by my genuine admiration for your recent posts , and the style others used to adopt with acres of blurb which is well above the knowledge threshold of most of us " Non Service" members.this being a "Public Forum" ;)

Your current posts on this forum have been factual without submersing the reader in systems of which we have no idea your on about , and yet avoiding jargon word usage which might impress ex service personal but baffle others less fortunate than yourselves ,who have had the benefit of that experience :oops:

I am sure others of my generation and those who were to walk a different path in life would agree with these comments .

I can only put this down to your roles in your professional career and being mindful of " making a point without drowning the pupil "

My thanks and gratitude 8-)
"What Ever Floats your Boat"
User avatar
Little h
Posts: 1727
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 6:53 pm

Type 23 Duke Class

Unread post by Little h »

HMS SUTHERLAND @HMSSutherland on Twitter
To be a @RoyalNavy Weapons #Engineer you might sometimes need to have a head for heights. Our Navigation Section Head, LET(WE) Eddie Grant changes one of our anemometers on the foremast. He still manages a smile despite being suspended more than 30m high.

That contribution on Twitter cautht my eye the other day - but having read the text and viewed the three accompanying images the methodology employed to complete this particular evolution has left me bewildered. This is especially so; since we are constantly informed that the RN is seriously cash strapped.


HMS Sutherland F81 DrbG9JMX4AAIGQ_.jpg

Surely this evolution could be performed without the aid (and cost) of a hired mobile extending/telescopic crane and bucket.



HMS Sutherland F81 DrbG8bvXgAA0RPd.jpg

Maintainer stretching from the suspended bucket having been lowered from crane jib to a point off the end of the yard. His
right hand apparently holding the body of the Anemometer whilst left hand appears to be turning the securing nut.



HMS Sutherland F81 DrbG9xFWoAAKFfR.jpg

Maintainer reaching out from the bucket holding the fixing nut at base of Anemometer with his left hand



Surely the maintainer could have scaled the mast and located him/herself at the end of the yard, two lines/ropes should have been carried aloft by the maintener with the trailing end of the first already secured to the replacement Anemometer. The second line/rope should have been secured to a/the maintener's tool bag containing the appropriate tools eg a) spanner(s), torque wrench, (soft) hammer and of course the obligatory WD 41.


Before anyone highlights the dangers of transiting from the foremast along the yard, might I advise that the Type 23 frigate comes complete with a reasonably wide ladder walkway as an integral part of the yard structure (see my captioned attachment below).
HMS Sutherland (F81),_Fremantle,_2018_(3).jpg

The attachment derived from an original image showing Sutherland F81 in Freemantle earlier in 2018 attribution Wikimedia Commons

Legend for the captioned attachment above:-
The first thing to establish is that the images in the tweet show the Anemometer mounted on the port side[1] (indicated by red arrow), on a yard that projects fwd and outboard toward the port bow... this was established by the proximity of the 'flying saucer' [5] (indicated by light brown arrow) near the end of the yard. It was therefore not on the stbd yard [2] (indicated by orange/black cross).
The reasonably wide ladder walkway referred to earlier can be identified at [3] (indicated by three yellow/red arrows).
The retractable bar extending from the end of the yardarm structure can be identified at [4] (indicated by the large dark red/pink arrow).



Note that the Anemometer is mounted on a bracket welded to and at the end of a bar that itself is secured to the end of the yard by two cleat type bolted brackets. The associated cable for the Anemometer is by way of a trailing wire and is only secured to a) the bar and b) the yard by cableties .... thus the whole assembly comprising the bar, Anemometer and cable could have been withdrawn inboard to the end of the yard and replaced.
HMS Lancaster IMG_0388 (4).JPG

This image is from my visit to HMS Lancaster when the ship was open to visitors whilst in Liverpool

The whole assembly can be identified within the red outline.
The broken blue arrows indicate the direction that the whole assembly could have been withdrawn for Anenometer maintainence and/or replacement and subsequently extended and secured.

That is my submission.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Little h
User avatar
jbryce1437
Posts: 1879
Joined: Sun Aug 05, 2018 7:28 pm
Location: Roker, Sunderland

Re: Type 23 Duke Class

Unread post by jbryce1437 »

Thanks Harry, I hope he never has to do it without the "cherry picker"

Jim
HMS Raleigh 1963 , HMS Collingwood 1963 & 67 , HMS Ark Royal 1964-7, HMS Undaunted 1968-71, HMS Victory (Fleet Maintenance Group) 1971-72, HMS Exmouth 1972-74
JEM, EM, OEM, LOEM, POOEL
Then 28 years in the Fire Brigade
Retired since 2002
User avatar
Little h
Posts: 1727
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 6:53 pm

Re: Type 23 Duke Class

Unread post by Little h »

jbryce1437 wrote: Mon Nov 12, 2018 6:28 pm Thanks Harry, I hope he never has to do it without the "cherry picker"

Jim
Thanks for your response Jim; I still think that the modern RN sailor, having undertaken various leadership courses - (during which there will have been numerous tasks set and hopefully successfully completed) - would approach this type of evolution as a routine task that had been thoroughly assessed for any/all problems; risks; and costs - resulting in an in-house solution where a member of ship's company goes aloft. No external involvement necessary IMHO.

The attachment below identifies the equipment that my branch specialisation had routine responsibility for:- a) The HF/DF 'birdcage' surmounting the mast; below which were b) the 3 x 4 SHF/DF horns (AYC/AYD/AYE) - all within the red rectangle.
We had a shared responsibility for the general upkeep of the 'christmas trees' at the end of both port and stbd yardarms.

The attachment shows Camperdown (D32) taken in Devonport Dockyard during the commission that I served in her. I spent many an hour aloft cleaning and/or replacing various elements of said aerials/antenna :)

In addition to the normal equipment hanging from/attached to our belts - the lads on carriers will have had an oxygen bottle to assist with the long climb when they went aloft into the clouds :D

, hms camperdown d32 shipsandharbours 16314 (2).jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Little h
User avatar
ivorthediver
Posts: 3659
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:42 pm
Location: Cambridge Shore Battery

Re: Type 23 Duke Class

Unread post by ivorthediver »

Your case is proven me lord , totally agree with you Harry , even I could do that ......certainly when younger and I'd have a crack at it now , if anyone wants to call my bluff :mrgreen:

Not sure about a Cherry Picker getting that high Jim and buckets on cranes defiantly a no no if that modus-operandi used it would need to be in a cage all adding further hire costs

To hire one of those a few years back would have cost several hundred pounds plus travel to and from site , so not cheap £300.00 ish THEN so nearer £500.00 +vat min now days if your lucky
"What Ever Floats your Boat"
User avatar
Little h
Posts: 1727
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 6:53 pm

Re: Type 23 Duke Class

Unread post by Little h »

Monmouth (F235)

Here is a photo of a fine model of Monmouth (F235); posted by Ivorthediver in the 'Model Makers - General thread'
ivorthediver wrote: Sun Nov 11, 2018 8:50 pm
Heres one I took especially for YOU at the Show ....F235 :D

Sorry its not so sharp but it was a busy day with a lot of people barging around and jostling about so hope its ok
My Comment; Good to see the modeller has got the black crown on the funnel and the black ship name on the hull port side aft.

_____________________

Because:-
The Monmouth is known as the “Black Duke” and is named for James Scott, the Duke of Monmouth, who rebelled against King James II in 1685 and was eventually beheaded.

“His coat of arms is the only one in the House of Lords to have been blacked out,” according to the Royal Navy. “As such HMS Monmouth is the only warship to have the ship’s name painted black with black crowns on the flag staffs and, in addition to the white ensign, she flies a black flag.”
HMS Monmouth is unique in the Royal Navy as in reference to the heritage of the name “The Black Duke” the frigate flies a black flag and has black, rather than the traditional red, name plates.

_____________________

So here are some images showing those and other 'black' features associated with the 'Black Duke'.

Note the black crowns on the jack staff fwd and the ensign staff aft, also the black flag flying from the truck at the mainmast.
1HMS Monmouth 2017 17155298_417674708578221_6584537111576925144_n (2).jpg

Closer views of a) the Jack staff and b) the Ensign staff!!
1HMS Monmouth F235 DR150140061 Royal Navy.MOD.UK.jpg
1HMS Monmouth F235 DrlCyDSVsAAo9U2 (2).jpg


The black crown on the funnel (plus the black flag again)....
1HMS Monmouth F235 7748251282_17fb0f98ff_b Flickr.jpg

....and that's a lot of black associated with the gangway.
1HMS Monmouth F235 130307-Monm-Hosts-CJO-1 royalnavy.mok.uk.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Last edited by Little h on Fri Nov 16, 2018 1:40 am, edited 10 times in total.
Little h
User avatar
ivorthediver
Posts: 3659
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:42 pm
Location: Cambridge Shore Battery

Re: Type 23 Duke Class

Unread post by ivorthediver »

Speechless :o .......there you never thought you could do that eh Harry :lol:

You never cease to amaze me with your knowledge on items obscure to others , or was this Duke your hero ;) .

If you look at the first picture again and the spherical white item half way up the forward mast it seems to have obtained two eyes and a smile ........ :?: , not you again was it Harry ....

Thank you for educating us [of lesser knowledge levels] mate of which I should be flogged as it is our History you refer to ;)
"What Ever Floats your Boat"
User avatar
Little h
Posts: 1727
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 6:53 pm

Re: Type 23 Duke Class

Unread post by Little h »

ivorthediver wrote: Fri Nov 16, 2018 9:05 am Speechless :o .......there you never thought you could do that eh Harry :lol:
You never cease to amaze me with your knowledge on items obscure to others , or was this Duke your hero ;) .
If you look at the first picture again and the spherical white item half way up the forward mast it seems to have obtained two eyes and a smile ........ :?: , not you again was it Harry ....
Thank you for educating us [of lesser knowledge levels] mate of which I should be flogged as it is our History you refer to ;)
Thanks for the comments Ivor.

- Black Duke not a hero of mine; but I declare an interest - the brother of our third g/son's wife is currently serving on F235.

- Re. first picture, I presume you are referring to the Sperry Sea Archer 30 (GSA-8) - (or current variant) optronic surveillance/director 'happy face' .


DSCF4628 (2).JPG
, Dryt6fXX4AAwOWy.jpg


1st attachment; HMS Lancaster; own image taken whilst Lancaster whilst open to visitors in Liverpool 28-2-2018
2nd attachment; .@hms_argyll currently deployed in the #FarEast is undertaking a valuable period of maintenance in #Singapore NavyLookout Retweeted Defence Operations Verified account @DefenceOps Nov 12
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Little h
User avatar
Little h
Posts: 1727
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 6:53 pm

Re: Type 23 Duke Class

Unread post by Little h »

Further to 2nd image in previous post - HMS Argyll F231, the Type 23 is alongside in Singapore at the British Defence Singapore Support Unit (BDSSU) and is undergoing routine maintenance to prepare her for the next stage of her deployment.
royalnavy.mod.uk/news-and-latest-activity

______________________________

Might this be a new RAM (Random Access Memory) installation :)

or

I don't remember the old Sembawang Dockyard Mateys ever being this forgetfull!!!! - Post-It stickers everywhere :lol:
Screenshot (3520).png

Image carried in a tweet on Grey Funnel Line @GreyFunnelLine on Twitter - Nov 15; that reads:-
HMS Argyll has been in the South China Sea operating with allied navies from Singapore, Australia, Malaysia and New Zealand. Now, the Type 23 is alongside in Singapore undergoing routine maintenance to prepare her for the next stage of her deployment..

______________________________

OK I'm a teeny weeny bit sorry - but I just couldn't resist (yet again)
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Little h
Post Reply Previous topicNext topic

Return to “Ships/Boats Equipment”